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Arcana ruin the leveling experience and fun

StigtriX| StigtriX 10/6/2018 13:25:19
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Edited by StigtriX at 10/14/2018 04:39 AM

League of Legends removed the old rune system as the progression did not feel satisfying, and the runes also led to imbalance. I hope that Arena of Valor will find a more meaningful and fun way to add depth, as Arcana are boring to collect and just result in bigger numbers. They do not affect gameplay in a way that is fun, and they force me to have a smaller hero pool as I lack arcana for all classes. Why would I play classes with less than ideal Arcana in a competitive game?

I would use more money if you did not insist on limiting me in such a meaningless way. Let me play the classes I want to play without the need for a mindless grind that does not feel satisfying or meaningful. It is just bad design.



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From_Hell| From_Hell 10/9/2018 14:09:11
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First, if you like playing many different hero’s F2P I would like to point out multiple things:

1. There is a generic arcana page(s) that work for practically every hero (I forget what it was but could probably be searched up. I know for green arcana you get armor and I think Benevolence for Purple Arcana but not certain). It’s mostly just putting generic buffs like HP bonus and armor bonus. CD arcana works great on any character (from experience).

2. Arcana adds very little compared to the skill needed to master characters. It might make a difference if you were one of the top players in the world and needed that +100 AP or so to barely kill opponents or +15 armor to barely survive, but at levels lower than that you can run mage arcana on an ADC (that’s not Valhein) and get away with it. You only need to buy one page of arcana, and you are good to go, see point 1 for that matter.

If you plan to pay money....

1. You can unlock arcana pages...

2. You can buy hero(s)....

I don’t get the complaint to be honest. The main reason swapping classes isn’t advised is since it’s hard for most people to learn how to play another role/hero not because something trivial like arcana. I practice Azzen’Ka a lot and can say for certain I can 1v1 (FTR Azzen’ka Sucks at 1v1s) most players playing a hero they have never played before and crush them with or without relevant arcana (not because the player is bad per say but rather they lack familiarity and practice. This is a skill based game). Even if they have perfect arcana for the character it won’t make a noticibke difference. I admit not using ANY arcana at all hurts (level 2 arcana work just fine so unless you have already spent 20K on level 3 arcana there is no point in NOT using level 2 arcana), but they hand out so many free-be arcana that after a month you just have to sell level 3 arcana for a quick 600 gold...

Hope this helps....
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HannibalMD| HannibalMD 3 day(s) ago
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I have to agree with this. I like to collect heroes and skins, not to grind my ass or waste vouchers for something as stupid as arcana. It feels like a chore.. something you have to do to be able to go back to enjoying your game.
Also i used to play adc, and i build my arcanas for adc. Then i took a break from the game and now i returned  and i no longer like adcs, i enjoy tanks, off-tanks and supports... and that's a shitload of arcana to be grinded before i can go back to enjoying the game...
No need to be greedy for stupid stuff... people who spend on the game would still spend. My guess is that they'll go to a system like lol once they milked all the profits out of the current system.
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Chipolino| Chipolino 5 day(s) ago
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I completely agree with StigtriX on this one. The arcana system is dull and boring, it adds little to nothing to the overall gaming experience. There is no real choice or creativity behind it either, each hero has a certain arcana page that simply fits the best, which everyone can just look up on samurai gamers or the aov discord. The prices are way too high: one full level 3 arcana page is worth more than 3 hero's - which is ridiculous imo.

I hope the arcana system will get revamped soon.
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StigtriX|  Author| StigtriX 10/14/2018 02:32:59
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Edited by StigtriX at 10/14/2018 04:43 AM
From_Hell replied at 10/9/2018 02:09 PM
First, if you like playing many different hero’s F2P I would like to point out multiple things:

1. ...

You do not seem to get the problem as you ignore it. That is not a solution.

1) Generic Arcana pages are bad. They do not take away the problem as they do not give specific champions the stats they need, just some generic survivability that is not worth that much and with no scaling. On top of that, making generic pages only prolonges the boring chore of collecting pages for different classes.

2) Arcana do not add "very little"! They can be the difference between getting a kill or getting killed. Let us compare the difference between level 1, 2 and 3 Attack Damage Arcana:



Do you see how much of a difference that is? Even more so if a player has not bought Arcana. As a marksman with level 2 Attack Damage Arcana I deal more damage and can take more damage. With level 3 Arcana I deal a lot more. Your ignorance really baffles me.

3) How is unlocking Arcana pages going to change the problem? The problem is the Arcana system itself. Riot Games removed runes in League of Legends because they did not add any value to the game - no fun or meaningful interactions were to be had. The new talents add flavour and choice, something Arcana in Arena of Valor never can do. They are a chore to collect and then you forget them.

From the League of Legends page about Runes Reforged:

"Forging a better Runes system first means concentrating the system's power into fewer choices so that each selection matters more. In the current Runes and Masteries systems, there are roughly 60 distinct slots, but very few of those choices have a significant impact on how your champion plays. Most of these slots are used up equipping your character with "required" stats like attack speed, armor, and magic resist. This makes much of Rune/Mastery selection more of a chore than a choice. Additionally, splitting all of the power across so many pieces prevents us from making any of your choices important—or powerful—enough, to really be cool.

With this in mind we're moving those “required” stats into the background so you can focus on the parts that matter. Keystone Masteries were our first test of this new theory, concentrating more of the power into individual choices. As with Keystone Masteries, the new Runes system will focus less on passive stats (although there will still be some of that) and more on playstyle-defining effects."

YouTube video about the changes
https://youtu.be/bY67yCaGdno?t=57

4) Buying heroes does not help either. Did you even take the time to read my post? I am not buying new heroes because I lack Arcana to complement their abilities.

You need to be extremely ignorant to not understand the issue. The free Arcana are only level 2 unless you get lucky with the gem chests, which have a very low chance of containing level 3 Arcana.
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From_Hell| From_Hell The day before yesterday 10:22 PM
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As I clarified on a later response it is not an issue.

1st you can complain about the differences of a hodgepodge arcana page when you reach diamond +. It took me under a month to get a new arcana level 3 arcana page just collecting free stuff and playing games. Generic arcana pages are not bad. While they don’t allow for specialization they are better than nothing. Also this game is perfectly playable with NO arcana from ranks bronze - plat and it is a skill based game. Bottom line, if you can’t play the character you will lose with or without arcana in a conflict.

2nd point seems to ignore that you can buy items in game....and there is an item that gives +200 Attack (300+ if under 50% hp). Running calculations on characters abilities and basic attack (plus defense and hp stats), there is only a slight advantage for players who use arcana in the beginning of the game and even then it’s nearly non-existent since it’s unlikely (impossible on diamond rank plus) that you are having a mirror matchup against a team with just better arcana (and they are the same skill level). Late game a difference of 20 attack is negligible. This is not ignorance merely seeing the bigger picture here. Ultimately items and in game gold matter more than arcana ever will/can. I hope you glanced at the buffs from items before you called me ignorant since even the cheapest items are worth about a page of level 3 arcana... (CD arcana are not much of a boon since every usual item in the game reduces CD as well).

3. Are league and AOV similar? Absolutely! However, Tencent has taken a different approach to the problem and they solved it fine. Unless you are one of the top players in the game getting an HP buff instead of the “precise ratio of attack and attack speed buff” isn’t going to mean squat. Literally arcana is not noteworthy after you build a quick generic page plus a specialization page (for me it was Mage).

This arguement is groundless since you ultimately ignore:

- Items existing and their numerical statistical significance
- Skill nessecary  to play characters and lack of mirror match ups
- Free hand out arcana
- Free hand out gold (aka spins and level x arcana chests plus exp cards)

I haven’t spent a cent so far and have obtained 4 pages worth of arcana (level 3) and sold them, bought 3 pages of level 3 arcana (and sold the arcana I didn’t like anymore) and have roughly half the characters in the game.

Honestly I am swimming in more characters than I can play and I haven’t changed one of my arcana pages in nearly a year. As you need to know how to play every role in random que the arcana I equip is far from “ideal” for half the characters I play, but I still manage fine (in fact the characters I win games with tend to NOT LIKE the arcana I use).

Lastly to rebuttal the “grinding arcana before enjoying the game”: don’t bother. Use level 2 arcana and any level 3 arcana they hand out sorting them between AP and AD arcana. Buying choice arcana is something some players really enjoy (like myself) and isn’t really nessecary. Having a mix match of benevolences, colossus, and tyrant really didn’t hurt me at all. I even ran Hex for a while on my AD page before I maxed out my green arcana to be -10% CD (ironic since I tend to buy 35% to 50% CD down in items most games. Plus the blue golem buff reduces CD by 20% and CD reduction maxes out at 40%....). Am I the number one player in NA? Hell no, but I floated up to plat with ease (once I learned how to play one character I liked) and I have seen friends make it to diamond plus with only generic arcana (tanking arcana is not considered the ideal build for a Tulen). Hell, one of my friends made it to plat without arcana above level 2 (and under level 30 as well. I think they were around level 20 if I remember correctly—I know them IRL so they weren’t lying...I watched them).

In conclusion: it hurts to admit it but skill is the ultimate factor believe it or not. Despite my superior arcana or slight initial gold advantage, there are players I know who can pound me down and then some. It has taken me an agonizing half a year to learn some hero’s—in which I consider myself to still be learning. Talent is nothing short of a godsend more valuable then a free 50K gold login bonus which I do not have. I cannot help but be mildly scornful of players that claim lack of results are due to having too little arcana or gold—or worse, their teammates. Instead of complaining about what you don’t have remember it’s a game: it’s not made to be easy and the player on the other team probably is in the same place as you where all you can do is try your best.

I apologize if this message was to scathing since this whining really struck a nerve, but do listen to another player’s experience: YOU DO NOT NEED TO BUY ARCANA THAT PERFECTLY COMPLIMENTS A HERO***.

***(though there is no harm in doing so—I only did it for my favorite hero though)
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